Craig Benner (Accretive Media) on DOOH and Connected TV.

Recording. Awesome. Um, so normally this is where I would read a big intro. So I've got an intro just for you. I like it. All right. All right, here we go. Welcome to out-of-home insider the loudest voice in out of home, and we've got a really special guest and you guys know typically this is where I read a long glorious introduction, but the only appropriate introduction here is ladies and gentlemen, please welcome the undefeated undisputed heavyweight champion.

The all time leading. Of the out-of-home insider show podcast, downloads and views and all that. He's the number one guest of all time. Craig men are welcome back. Uh, you know, the SQL is always less interesting than that. And the original list Cobra Cobra, Kai has proved that concept wrong. So I feel like, I feel like we got didn't have a Russo out here and we're going to do something pretty fun today.

What are you. You know, just, uh, just doing the deal, you know, it's been, it's been, it's been fun. Uh, venues are opening up the complexion of the business has changed again. Um, you know, we're just, we're, we're continuing to work with our brand partners and, and just live in life in this new. Yeah, it's, it's certainly been, uh, the world has changed a little bit since we, since we did this last time.

Um, and speaking of change, something that we maybe talked about a little bit, uh, creative, just launched a pretty cool concept with connected to. Yup. So, uh, so teased it out a little bit. I'd kind of a travel ban when we talked about it, but we did, we launched a creative connect, which is a, which is the industry's first, the industry's first digital out of home to connect a TV format sequencing products.

So it's effectively, it's effectively consumers. It's it's consumers. We'll see. One of our targeted digital out of home ads. And then we'll be able to extend the value of that investment into the living room and, uh, and reinforce the brand message into, uh, you know, over the top devices and connect TV. So the, so, so really the, the, the story there is, is we know what out-of-home is good with.

We, we know it's, it's brand building. We know there's big, beautiful screens and. If we can couple that exposure with, uh, with something that's a little more emotive videos, sight, sound emotion, kind of more of a lean back experience inside the home. Kind of those two exposures. If we can, if we can control the exposure cadence, we know that that will have massive recall benefits, massive response benefits.

And, uh, in all of our kind of proving out the concepts it's, it's, it's been highly validated. So we're, we're super excited about the, uh, the product and, uh, And clients are too, as good as we've rolled it out. It's, it's, uh, it's been highly resonant to, uh, to, to, to brands and agencies and clients. Right?

Cause it reeks of two things that I love, which is efficiency and also effectiveness. Was this something, was this an idea that came out of, uh, out of a conversation or out of a need, was somebody asking for this or just something you thought made sense and wanted to test with. So it was it's. It's interesting because we've always done.

You know, and I, I think last time I was on, I even talked about, Hey, you know, uh, heterogeneous exposures to different mediums and different formats is key to maximizing where you call an ultimately inducing some sort of behavior that you care about, right. Inducing outcomes that you care about. And, and it actually brought me back to probably 10, 12 years ago.

And, uh, And along this theme of every format has its place in media mix optimization. And I remember we were working with back when I was in digital, we were working with one of the large domestic audits and, and they cared about, this was a lower funnel in market campaign and they're running display and they were running search and they were, they were doing like building price and leads.

And it was, it was all about driving that efficiency. And we were doing the, we were doing the display and they're running their service. And on a cost per KPI standpoint, search was out outperforming display. So they said, okay, cool. We're just going to zero sum. We're just going to take all of the display budget and we're going to dump it into search.

And we said, probably not the best idea, but you be you. And, uh, and they did that. And their search volumes went down 40%, you know, spoiler alert. Yeah. Not the best strategy for anybody that, that may not be familiar with. Why, why, why did that happen? So, because display was driving the internet. Which search ultimately transact, right?

Because a better way to capture demand, then search exactly how to create demand. Exactly. Exactly. So they ultimately said, okay, well, you know, we can't even spend this money because we didn't, we couldn't generate any demand. So the, the, the moral of the story was, was, yeah. You know, display much like out of home, you, you need to understand the place of each.

And you need to understand that, that you need to generate intense. You need to cultivate intent or influence, and then ultimately you can transact that. And, and it's funny when you can control the exposure cadence. Uh, creative connect. Then you can say, you can say this is an audience. This is a cohort that, that saw these out of home ads, which we know are high-impact, you know, fraud free 14 by 48 big beautiful ads.

And then ultimately reinforce that message in more of a lean back. Uh, environment inside the home with, you know, 1530, second spots. We've been longer form spots on connected TV, where more and more people are spending more and more of their time. Uh, all of a sudden you have, you can build intelligent frequency across intelligent formats and, and, uh, and ultimately tell that story, which you just flat out couldn't and, and keep in mind, this is not an omni-channel.

This is an out of home solution, which, which focuses on the, the, how special our format is and how differentiated our format is because it starts with the unique and differentiated way. We can communicate as a format with our, with our constituents, with our consumers in the physical world and elaborate on why that delineation is so important, you know, because it's.

We are unique and there's a, there's a huge, there's a huge kind of too many times out of home is an afterthought. And, and it's, and th there's there, there's kind of dueling factions right now in the out-of-home space. Where, where a lot of times, um, a lot of times people think just by virtue of making our inventory available, that people are just going to start buying.

And, and I specifically. Delineate omni-channel versus versus out-of-home specific because a lot of the omni-channel DSPs are starting to offer, um, digital out-of-home as, as a bolt on solution. And, and the big debate is kind of access versus education. Um, and the right answer is, you know, is it access or education?

The right answer is yes. Right? It's it's you need to educate. Make sure people understand the effectiveness of the format and then ensure that it's accessible everywhere, but just by virtue of making the inventory available on omni-channel DSPs does not mean that it's going to be, it's going to be purchased.

Um, we still have a ton of work to educate the market digital buyers, strategy teams, um, out-of-home specialists as to why. Digital out-of-home programmatic digital out of home, broader digital out of home. Uh, strategically purchased from an audience standpoint can be effective in driving outcomes before we democratize and commoditize the inventory.

Like ultimately it can be transacted right now before we can just expect droves and droves and droves of people to be, to be purchasing it. Um, the way that it is purchased. Like other similarly situated programmatic formats. Is this where the fragmentation of out of home really becomes the Achilles heel?

Is the education or, or how does, how do you, how does a creative educate its clients on why this is a best practice and, and how it makes sense? You know, it's the fragmentation doesn't help. Um, It's it doesn't help, but it's not, it's not the Achilles heel. I, I think, I think it's, we just need more reps, you know, w we just, that's, that's really the reality of it.

We need to standardize our messaging to, um, standardize our messaging to the market. Like, like, I think it should be intuitive that, that. The, that measurement should be the number one priority for everyone. And again, I want to make a distinction between counting and effectiveness, like counting and impressions.

That's that? I think we're, that's, that's kind of outside of my purview. That's, you know, that's the geo paths and then the cancers of the world. Um, but I'm talking about effectiveness. Um, That should be number one goal for everyone is let's make everything more accountable and educate how we can ultimately drive results on the DPW video summit.

Every time a brand was speaking, they said, we'd love to spend more, but no one can figure out attribution. No one can figure out measurement. No one can. And it's like, Yeah, people have figured that out. It just hasn't been socialized to you. Like why, why are you not demanding more? Why are you not doing measurement?

Um, so, so that's been, that's been a dearth of education that just hasn't existed, which, which, you know, I wish we had more reps and I wish, I wish ultimately we were able to do, we were able to get in those ears and get more studies out, get more case studies. Ultimately in the hands of, uh, of some of these clients, so they can see.

Again, when executed properly and measured properly, it's astounding how the, how this format works. It's astounding, how effective this, this format can be. Yeah. And I, I think we can, we can all have the conversation, whether you're listening, if. Local level business development rep, and you're listening to the show and getting a ton of value, ton of content, dive in, more, get, get, get more information.

And then from the top down, if we can all start having that conversation and get past, I mean, sure. I'm going to say, I'm going to say the, you know, the, the peacemaking, the, the rounds this week, that, what is it? 70% of people notice out of homework. That's cool. Um, also no one cares. It's like, we got to stop hanging our hat on this thing that people notice it.

Like, yes, we all agree. We notice it and creating a, a tangible measurement. Does the creative connect concept, like what, how are you measuring the results of, of combining the two mediums? So we're, we're going to do a very scientifically, you know, with. We're going to create different segments so we can understand the influence that each format on their own in each format together.

So we're going to build methodologically. We're going to be, it's all going to be test control, like, like we typically do, and it's going to be unexposed entirely. Exposed just to CTV exposed just to, out of home and exposed to, uh, the format sequence, um, ads and that way, excuse me, they can see, they can see all of the different combinations and sequencing sequencing of ads and ultimately make a determination of, of how much.

Incrementality and lift, they get from, uh, from the solution offering from each of the formats. And it's all gonna be based on whatever outcome they care about, whether that's online sales, whether that's online visitation, whether that's offline sales, whether that's foot traffic, whether that's tune in, whether that's, you know, it's, it's, we're gonna, we're going to start, you know, go move backwards.

We're going to start with the outcome that they care about. And then we're going to go backwards into the execution. Um, And another thing that we're, that, that we're doing is we're making sure, um, that, that, because we understand, um, how the, the environment in, out of home that we're working with and we're actually, uh, we're collaborating with, you know, Ian was just on, um, We're collaborating with, with the major roadside guys, um, like, like the upfronts and the Lamar's of the world, because we know roadside is going to be a heavy duty, uh, piece of this to get massive reach with those big, beautiful bulletins and spectaculars that, um, that we're going to make sure that we're highly curated with the bundle IDs and that, and the CTV app lists so that we avoid any fraud.

Environments. Cause we're already seeing that one of every five CTV ads are fraudulent. No kidding. Which any time DoubleVerify just came out with that. So anytime month money floods the market with. Which, um, which CTV is now an $11 billion market out of nowhere. Um, it's, it's now like they came out with their first study and it's like, it's like nearly 20% that they can account for.

So we're going to be highly curated to ensure that we're on the we're on the losing the foxes and the Doobies and the potatoes and the, and the, and the named bundle ideas and apps that we can ensure that this is all viewable and, and this. All high visibility, high quality exposure to exposure. Make sure that it's the first coupling of broadcast, a broadcast, um, is going to be high-impact high recall high response, high success for our client partners.

How do we, how do we avoid. A zero sum game. Right? Are we, are we adding CTV money to budgets? Are we shifting budgets? How do you see this all playing out over time? And it's. That's part of the that's part of the, um, that's part of the, the, the broader strategy is, is we're we're up leveling where we're talking to these consumers where, or where we're talking to these brands and agencies is, is, you know, historically the, the flow of money has been brands to agency to strategy, to media, to trading desk, to out of home.

And it's, and it's like what we're saying. And that kind of speaks to the, to the omni-channel piece too. It's like, wait. So if we're, if we're all relying on the trade desk to win, that's five layers removed from the brand sometimes, um, like let's, let's make sure we can put together really cogent, smart strategies at the brand and the strategy level and, and with, with our special.

Partners and with our creative partners. And then all of a sudden the silos don't matter as much because they can tap from multiple sources. Um, and it's just about. The customer consumer centricity. And it's about making sure that you're telling the right story that these creatives have ultimately spent, you know, their entire production budgets on making sure that that, that it stays on brand and ultimately can, uh, can, can extol the virtues of the brand and, and, and tell the story that you want them to do across.

Right. So if we can, if we can cut some layers out of the middle, uh, and, and just create better platforms, better strategies, better executions of the money, then we're, we're, everyone's going to make more. Yeah, it's less about cutting them out. And it's more about just collaboration with all of them and, and ensuring that everyone, everyone is working together to win.

Right. Um, and, and it's less of a, it's less of a competitive issue and more of a, we're all gonna win. Cause this is all gonna it's again, it's not just a spray and pray. Um, it's, it's more of a, we're going to collaborate and coordinate exposures of these high value formats together to ensure that both from a consumer and a brand perspective, the best stories told for that.

Absolutely. DPAA just wrapped up last week. Any, uh, any key takeaways? Um, it was so well done. Um, the, uh, Barry and the team did a fantastic job. Um, it w the content was great. The, um, I mean, the key takeaways is there's, there's a hunger for. For digitalization, there's a hunger for that education that we talked about.

Um, there's the, one of the key takeaways is that 2021 is going to be a great year, um, for all of us. Um, and it's, it's there. There's, there's a lot of innovation out there. There's, there's a lot of smart people thinking about things. Um, there's a lot of. It's funny. There's, there's a select, like the brands that participated all had really positive, really positive experiences.

We just need to zoom out and make sure that more of them, more of them are, are. Are participating as, as, as much as the ones that are, that are diving in. Um, and again, that's just a function of education. That's a functional, more reps. That's a function of, of, uh, of all of us working together to do this thing.

So I was highly encouraged, um, and really fired up coming out of that, uh, coming out of this. And that's awesome. And obviously that goes a long way to the education part. So kudos to Barry and the team for pulling that off. All of the feedback everybody has been talking about at very, very high accolades.

So great job. Thank you for sharing that. Craig, where can people find out more about creative connect, connect with you? Where, where are you most? Uh, LinkedIn is still the most active. They can go to creative ads.com. Um, we're working on a kind of a stealth, another, another site that that's going to be chock full of just brand success.

Um, you know, helping brands win.com right now. It just redirects to, uh, it just redirects to the creative ad site, but we're going to be working on something that just talks about the accountability. It literally just talks about. Case studies where brands and agencies have used our platform to drive results.

Um, and it's part of that education process to ultimately say, um, you know, the thesis is simple, right? 70% of our waking hours, we are outside. So theoretically we are consuming a ton of out of home inventory throughout the day. We're spending 400. The chasm is massive because we don't have the right measurement.

If we can show that you can win with this, it's not going to go to 70%, but it should. Is that going to go bigger than four? So it's, it's a, that's one of the things that we're working on. And then we have yet another big announcement, um, which is going to be in, um, in Q4, um, which is going to be product related.

Which will make it easier and, and, uh, more, it, it will make our product offering more accessible to the masses in a slightly different way, um, which will be good for brands across a larger swath of industries, markets, and geographies. We'll have to kick off the new year with, uh, talking about that. Craig as always been a pleasure.

Thanks for being. Thanks for having me and congrats on one year by the lab, say, Hey, thanks so much. Looking forward to doing a whole nother year of it. Hey, if you found this to be helpful, the number one way you can help the show, click the subscribe button down below, share this, leave a, like leave a comment.