OOH Insider - Episode 019 - Jean-Paul Gedeon, CEO of JPG Media

Welcome to the out-of-home insider show, the loudest voice in out of home where we're bringing you tips, tricks and insider insights. And my guest today has all three of the above. I've got none other than JPG, John Paul Getty, and from JPG media out there on the big island, Hawaii Aloha, my friend, how are you?

Aloha? Pretty good. I'm actually on the wahoo. It's the main island. I get it Hawaii. And one thing all sounds the same, you know, about it on Thursday. And I'm wondering, so we, we right before going live here, we were talking about a lot of stuff and some really important stuff. One of which was chia seeds, I'm going to come back to, because I think that the other topic has a lot more value to people listening.

Right now, we're talking about some of the top things, maybe the top five tips, top five tricks to work in at home because a lot of people can that shift right now. Do you work from home? Are you, are you remote operator? Uh, are you guys thinking about working from home? What's what's your take on the whole work home Monday?

So, no, I got a home office. Fortunately, I got a, an office in my home, but I know we have a location we're right in Waikiki. So I've got 11 staff. We've all got our workstations, you know, the whole desk in the studio to film the podcast and all that in the back and our big print shop. So yeah, usually we're all in close to each other, but luckily if someone's going to miss a meeting, which we have every Monday and Friday at 9:00 AM, we allow them to come in on Facebook messenger video.

So that's kind of preempted us on this a little bit, a little bit. So we, on Monday we had our first meeting, you know, everybody stay calm. It's not the end of the world. No one's losing their jobs. You know, you guys are going to get paid on. The 20th is coming. You can get paid, but not work. So we just had our first zoom meeting.

But before that is Facebook messenger, but not everybody on my team is on Facebook. No, that's cool. There's a young, blood's not on

zoom is cool. Zoom is how we're doing the show right now. Um, so everybody's sort of finding that, that one platform for them and their structure and, you know, we even tossed around at work Skype. Uh, I think we're going with the Cisco WebEx, which looks like a hybrid of slack and zoom, but definitely choosing some sort of communication tool that I think keeps the culture together.

Like seeing somebody's face, right. You're halfway around the world, but it's like, we're hanging out. So how important do you think that that is from a culture standpoint with the uncertainty of when are we going to be back in the office? How important do you think it is to, to retain culture? Right. Huge huge.

I've already seen it day one on Monday. If we didn't have our meeting, I know people will be in limbo. Like what's going on all this doom and gloom because people going to go out of business, like people are legitimately going to go out of business, firing staff, but I had my team come on the call.

Everybody's on. Usually we'll go around and let's talk about our jobs business. What's in the pipe. I said, you know, I'm going to push all that to the side. We're going to start out how you feel, how you feeling. So everyone got to express that they were feeling, you know, confusion, fear and loss and all this kind of stuff.

But it brought us all back to be humans because you know, we're humans in the first port. So even with our clients, we reached out and tour partners or property partners who we, you know, we partner with out of home ads. I said, you know what, let me know if you guys need anything. And I'm reaching out to you as a friend and a.

And aside from business and that connection right there, that was the thing to get us back on track, you know, like back on track. Cause we're all going crazy right now. Everyone's under pressure, brought us back. So we're humans first and this is a visual Tim. I feel like I'm hanging out with you. It's pretty much like where we got a social distance.

Anyway, fortunately, we've got a few thousand miles in between us, but to be able to have that from wherever your team is. Well, and the communication's incredibly important because that the communication is taken care of concerns from your team side, from your client's side, it's reinstilling confidence from the culture side, all of those things matter.

So, so maybe tip one is figuring out what that communication platform is going to be. How are we going to stay in contact throughout the day? I found myself, um, this is funny. It was about two o'clock in the afternoon, uh, here. And I was like, wait, I haven't, I haven't talked to my, my counterpart, my office mate, all day.

We would have normally hung out and talked and, you know, talk through strategies or, you know, just, just mused on the day or something by that point. So I called her, I was like, Hey, what are you doing? And she's hanging out with the husband and getting work done, got four kids hanging out. But like those little things that you just get used to.

So for me, like identifying what some of those routines and rituals are and reformatting them to this different template are really important. Um, taking advantage of the extra time during the day that I don't have to commute. I commute it's about an hour each way. It's two extra hours a day, took my dog for a walk.

So how do you, how important do you feel that figuring out your routine for the new format? Is it something that you guys have talked about? Yeah, this is absolutely essential. That's why we built a foundation with reaching back to have our culture, because we have a culture of, you know, striving forward, owning it and being entrepreneurial, all these sorts of things.

But the next far was the technology. So there's few things we're using to stay up with our routine because we don't want to get out of it. We've got the momentum we've been on the rise, you know, keeping that Boulder rolling in the snowball. Slack has been a good one for us. We're just sharing, you know, files and messages.

That very easy thing, larger files we're using Dropbox. We were using Facebook messenger to be on video, but we need something a little more sophisticated than that. So zoom, we jumped on that. There's a free version of zoom, 40 minute conversation and calls you can do that. Keeps things tight. Yeah. Yeah.

Cause that can happen. Tangent alert. We've got a thing called tangent alert. If you're going off on a tangent tangent alert, you know, we were running something like traction. So EOS entrepreneur operating systems book called traction. You can check it out, I'll help you. But, um, the last piece was phone only attraction, E O S entrepreneurs, entrepreneurial operating system.

A lot of people in one of the clubs I'm in entrepreneurs organization, they run their business like this. There's like the six components to running your business. You'll watch it. You can go on and see the free video. Download the book it's pretty cheap, but I tell you, majority of the people running these businesses, you know, minimum a million a year.

And then the next level of is minimum 15 million a year in revenue. This is how people are running their businesses and you can applies to every business. So tangent alert back on track, right? You staying connected and keeping that momentum. We're using slack, we're using Dropbox, we're using zoom. And the reason our phone go into an opportunity after this, after you.

Yeah, no. So pivot right there, pivot right there. Go to the opportunity opportunity right now we know people have a lot more time and are going to be on the social media channels. Like, you know this of course, to not think this, you wouldn't even be plugged in, but you're in your place, right? This is our time to speak.

This is our time to have a voice in it when it goes dark. Right. Is not taking advantage of the opportunity and could go dark forever, forever. Let people know you're opening, let people know, Hey, this is thing. Well, we did, we reached out, said, Hey, we took a screenshot of our, uh, I think it was like eight of us or six of us on the call.

It looked like the Brady bunch with all of our faces. And we said, Hey, we're still in business. We're still handling all of our orders. Our clients, our partners, and our team are very top priority, equally important. And we're working as fast as we can to fulfill everyone's orders because just this went out in the office in the media business.

The show must go on. Totally totally. Right, right. Because yeah. I've used the analogy with, with a few clients, uh, to this point that this is the proverbial drawing back of the arrow. Right. We know at some point it's going to go back to normal and when it does, we're not just going to like crawl forward, it's going to absolutely launch.

So to be cautious right now to be conservative right now, it could make sense. I don't necessarily prescribe to the, to the school of pullback, I think step on the throat right now, if you can, but being prepared for those things and having a partner that is with you along the way, through the good times and the bad.

So we talked about tools to bring your team together, to increase the communication so that you can continue to operate. We talked about culture and how to use some of those tools. Keep and facilitate that culture. And we talked about, um, I just brain farted. The last thing that we literally just talked about was

how does that happen? What was the last thing we just talked about routine routine routine. So that the tools that your team, that's it routine

captain's log day three brain is getting fast. So yeah, everyone's, everyone's listening to this going, Hey, dummy. You just said those three things. All right. So that's three out of five. Give me two more. What are two more things that we're not paying attention to? Maybe the opportunity, the opportunity, what we should be doing right now is taking advantage of all of the opportunity, creating content like this, having dialogue with our client.

Continuing to press forward and be the leader. That was something that we talked about, how important right now to be, what does it mean to be a leader right now? So instead of exactly what it means, that's something that I want to drive back into that this is the best opportunity to be a leader, because this is testing, you know, traditional leaders, CEOs, it's testing you right now.

And as, as good as you can lead as it is as good as you can take advantage and use this time as an opportunity. And it's also a time where if you don't lead that you could lose all momentum. Things could not go good in your business, but relating that to being a leader, I think it was a great time that you can be a leader.

Everyone could be. In their families to keep everyone calm, to make sure you have everything. You need a leader for your friends and your loved ones. Even a leader that we're sharing this online right now, hopefully this is going to bring some value to make other people feel empowered, to know that, Hey, everyone is going through the same thing we can freak out, or we can regroup.

Assess what's really going on. Do we have our food? Do we have our shelter? Is, is our income affected? Yes. Is our job at jeopardy possibly, but we're still alive. We're still humans. Now we need to make sure that we can chart this course together because it's uncharted territory for what we have going on right now.

So it's opportunity for everyone. I really can be a leader. Tim is a leader. You led me into this call. I'm leading my family and I got a daughter come in and a week she's going to be born my second daughter. So this is that's crazy, man. That's just amazing, amazing blessing. And I think that's a really good description of, you know, what, what it means to be a leader and how that's sort of the opportunity.

I agree, man. I think that right now we're going to look back and we're going to say, damn, that was maybe the biggest opportunity that any of us have seen in our lifetime because the entire playing field is. Everyone is moving at the exact same speed, but there's these little advantages where you can continue, where you can use tools to bring your team together, to instill a culture, to communicate with your clients, to be a leader in the space, to continue to do these things is going to separate you from everybody else that pulls back.

And that's, that's, that's a leader to me, for sure. Now, now let's transition to opportunity. Let's talk about the, there's a business show right here. Right? Let's talk about some opportunity. So as you said, the world is all moving at the same pace. Imagine this, we would all have we're all in the community.

We're going to different venues. We're going to different networking events in person we're in person. Right. But where is everybody now? Everybody's out people they're online. They're connected. Now, if you took the opportunity, if I did, like, I took a little bit of the opportunity, not as much as others to build your following before all this happened, we would have a larger audience to speak to whether it's Instagram or Facebook.

I personally love LinkedIn because it's, you know, my tribe business folks who have lives, we have a much larger platform now where the organic reach has been much better. I, you know, I posted a video. One of our podcasts get like 1400 views. That's, that's a lot for me, usually, if I'm on Facebook and they're like 20, or like maybe two or 500, and those are like grandma and grandpa and friends, but on LinkedIn, like, wow, these are really business people who are watching the business show that we do.

So the opportunity right now, two things, I just want to really couple of things for my business. So we sell advertising space. In grocery stores, for instance, right now, grocery stores are packed with people. Yeah. Well good. Or for bad, they need to stock up. We have positions at the entries exits and the checkout counter.

So we had healthcare companies who already had campaigns in the works. They said, can we get this up now? Because it's like, what an opportunity for everyone there it's super relevant reach out to us. So we've got, uh, a couple of the national guys who are on board at the checkout counters. So that's one thing, but how do we approach this opportunity without being spammy, without saying, I just want your money.

Let's talk about that. Because I think that there's a lot of salespeople right now that just they're sorta in that snag. And I gotta be honest. It took me a day or two to sort of feel out what's everybody's temperature. Like what's the company line. What's what should be the message right now? The message should not be buying out by.

Because I have archived those conversations in my inbox, click, you know, people are coming out oh, by this. And like, I am not in the market for digital screen right now. Can you stop asking me for that? Why don't you reach out and ask how I am, where people first, this is our opportunity to build that relationship, to know that we are build some rapport.

I'm not just selling you with that canned message that I just put your name on the top and maybe the company and the body somewhere. But the rest is like, say the last 27 people, you sent it to everybody and he spelled the name wrong. By the way, you still have the last guy's name in there when you said it.

Exactly. I am not.

Well, it's not during the weekdays. Yeah. You got to that's the bonus. That's the bonus content. If, if you want yeah, well, opportunity to be a human to make that real connection. People remember this, this is documented. This is documented. I'm so glad you said that because that's, that's something that I've tried to reiterate to people that just, you know, I've come in contact, having conversations with are sort of up against that same thing.

If you take nothing else away, people will remember how you responded right now. We'll go back to. How do you want to be remembered? Do you want to be remembered as the person that kept pushing to try and jam some something down someone's throat or you weren't willing to be flexible and maybe move a campaign or cancel something.

People are shot. People are worried about making payroll. And I just read a book. It's a, it's an, it's an interesting read. And I think it applies a lot to business called a spy's guide. Aspies guide to strategy. It's written by a CIA case officer and the whole concept is working, um, working assets for intelligence.

So getting human beings to give up information that could potentially compromise the enemy and the entire concept of how you got somebody to do that was by starting with their end game and working back. Right. So what's what, what matters to JPG right now? Well, it's obviously taking care of his family first and foremost, making sure that he has a safe place to welcome his baby girl into the world is taken care of his business.

Those are the things that matter to you. I'm assuming just based on our conversation now, but if we don't keep that in mind, it's going to be just me calling up and saying, Hey, I've got a great thing on this right now. And then how many do you want to buy? Not even understand. The last thing you want to worry about in this whole world is what I'm trying to talk about.

As, as an entrepreneur. Do you, do you still see people coming after that way? Do you think it's from a lack of just knowing what to do? Are you still seeing that my inbox is full of it today and. Okay. I still got people reaching out. Cause we go to a lot of trade shows. Sure. Sending, sending me emails.

Would you like to buy these trade show leads of people in the hospitality business? Like, you know, I get a few of these a day, but it's coming in hard now. I'm like, all events are canceled. These leads do me nothing right now. Plus it's like spam. It's not like, you know, an actual person behind that is just a random email, but there has been, you know, things, people reaching out.

Would you want to, you know, you still want to buy this $50,000 outdoor digital screen. Like, no, thank you for engaging in the conversation right now, but we're going to put that on hold still very interested. And I'm going to go through the conversation of the pricing, but don't push for the sale right now.

Why don't we want to connect for a second? Maybe just reach back to me, let me get on with life. So, you know, when people don't reply to me because I send out some emails, it's cool. I'm not trying to, I'm not trying to sell the world, but I want to ask you something or you can ask me, we're not a home game.

What are you doing about a cancellation? Cause people were calling, you know, if you got a restaurant, if you want me to go first, I can go first now. So, so yeah, so I was going to say, is it a restaurant that's giving a cancellation, uh, yeah. Potential opportunity for cancellation. So for me personally, I'm immediately assessing the situation, trying to understand what's what's the cause for the cancellation.

Is it because of uncertainty in your business or is it because of uncertainty in mind? Because I can tell you about my business, but I don't know enough about yours to make that decision for you. So let's have a conversation and try to understand, was it based around an event that's not going to take place now.

Could it make sense to potentially just push the campaign back? Do we maybe pivot, do you have the infrastructure to sell gift cards online? And I can predictably say, Hey, I can deliver this much traffic to your site to sell gift cards. Are there alternatives? And if there are, that makes sense, then let's explore them.

And if there aren't, I'm not interested in hurting your business or hurting your employees, I would much rather know that you've got that money available to make payroll for the next two weeks. And that, that single mother who's working a shift at your restaurant and the one down the street that she's going to be able to get paid so she can put food on her table.

That matters to me because after all this we talked about. People are going to remember, people are going to remember what you did in that moment. And that's how I would approach it. How about I just wrote that a good note. I like the whole gift card thing about, you know, selling right now, given the opportunity.

So what we have, we have one of our clients, they're advertising a couple of their locations on some of our shuttle advertising for mobile billboards. And it's been live for since, uh, January. They, you know, I talked to them yesterday and I express it. They seem very concerned. I know we, you know, we signed an agreement, you know, we've got our multi-year agreement going on and I reaching out to all of my vendors so I can see what they were leading up to because I, I listened to other people's podcasts the other day about how they're dealing with people wanting to cancel, you know, media.

I said, you know what? You don't need it to finish your sentence, but I do want to say something, I let her speak. I said, this. If you're mandatory closed because the government here state of Hawaii is limiting restaurants in bars, and this is a fine dining establishment, and they haven't really set up what they're going to do for takeout and all this yet, because it's still busy.

It's crazy. We have so much tourists still coming in on airplanes and cruise ships. So they're full. The restaurant is full and they're they're popping. But I said at that time that you guys are going to slow down with the mandatory shutdown, we can revisit your agreement. We can still keep your media up.

Cause it's a vehicle wrap. We're not gonna take it down and put it back up. We'll just leave it up. I got to talk to my partners, but for the time you're closed, we just won't bill you. And we're going to go and put that onto the back end of your agreement. So if it's a two year agreement and just what you're shut down for three months, we're going to add an extra three months on the back because you know what.

We're not here to make these one-time short term sticky to your contract deals is a multi, so looking forward, you know, or very forward-thinking kind of guys, I think that's a great play because right. That's what we would do with our mortgage. For example, in a, in a hardship time, I'd say, Hey, listen, I can't pay it right now, but I still need my house and I need it.

I need to do business. And they made an agreement. So, right. That's a, that's a win-win everybody gets what they wanted. They don't have to pay you right now. They're still able to honor your commitment. You can predictably rely on that income for the agreed time. I can't think of a better outcome given the situation.

That's what I thought. I, you know, that's a very fair thing to do. And we talked as humans, we talked to his people is this is one of those humanizing events that we all get caught up in the numbers and the economy is frothy. Everybody's making money and it's. The market's going up. We're all saying it's going to need, there's going to be a correction.

There's going to be a correction. Oh yeah. We didn't know it was going to be this. Sure. What? This is where we're at. So how do we move forward here? Like you said, it's connecting with people. So that was number four or was the opportunity. So we got the technology, we've got the culture routine opportunity.

We got leadership in there too. That's I guess that's five. That could be, I think Lee opportunity was, I think, as leaders opportunity to be a leader, opportunity to be a leader. Let's say that. No, no, no. I'm cool with it. Let's stay on an opportunity for a second because you're a guy that gets opportunity.

You control the ecosystem, right? You've got the printing in house. You have relationships for the space. You're not depending on things to be, especially in time, like right now, like you can run out, print it and then install it the same day. You're not waiting on things to be shipped from somewhere else.

Like you're not dependent on anybody else, which there's like a life lesson in there. Right? Just, just if you can reliance self-reliance for sure. But in a state where there are no billboards, you have an out of home company. Explain that to me opportunities. I said, man, they used to be billboards. There used to be billboards.

You know, I think it was in the, before the fifties, shut it down. Good thing. We could still see the mountains. It's beautiful. But I've been to Australia. I've been to Vegas. I've been to Hong Kong and Japan and many and Costa Rica. And I made the countries. Now, when you look at what's out there and you come back to Hawaii, it is like a tiny.

Japan is the future, like 10 years, 10 years ahead. And they're like a few hours ahead. And then it's a close flight. So when we come back, we're like, whoa, everything is still the same here. So we go there and we see the future, come back, bring it here. But yeah, the state with no billboards, how are we making it work?

Just alternative ways. Like how do we get in front of the customer and in a unique way that they can engage with on the customer's journey, you've got to buy groceries. You're going to walk around the mall, you're going to drive. And we have some of the worst traffic in the nation in Hawaii, just gridlock.

So we take advantage of all of these spaces. It's smart. Right? You're assessing where's their attention and how can I monetize that attention? Yeah. Yeah. In a way that brings value. Not, I mean, yeah, we're in. But I really think it's important how you make your money, not just how much you make, because you can make a lot of money anywhere.

Sure. Let's say, um, there's a lot of opportunity. Just depends where you look. So to make sure that we're bringing value big topic in that home space right now is measurement an opportunity to talk about measurement. I haven't talked about this concept that I'll share today, but how are you measuring for your clients?

Is it impressions? Is it, you know, total exposed people? Cause I know that you're hearing a lot of retail locations. How do you go about having the measurement conversation? So with grocery stores, for instance, the reason we chose them is because people are going there like habitually plus there's video cameras, but there's one real thing that we like to use when it's.

You can see impressions. You can see, you know, people have historical sales data that they share with you or that they internally will utilize. You know, when you make a recommendation, okay. Do this campaign in the summer, you know, do do summertime. And let's see these numbers compared to last summer, you can compare those, but not everybody's as sophisticated as that.

Sure. We have a like citizen grocery divided. We designed it, designed it, it patent is great. We want a dental clinic on it. So what they did specifically, so, you know, you can get a slide. The, I just love that it's vertical, then the little square ones, there's so much more visible space. And that what you just did is so easy.

Yeah. So anyone in the store can slide this in. If you can change the price on the store shelves and your staff can change this, we ship these out all day. So this is something we were going nationwide first in the U S and then we have patents. I know other countries as well, Japan, Canada, Australia, European union, UK, but we are talking about opportunity and there you're talking about measurement.

We measure through sales transactions is a way to show proof of proof of I'm posting as a picture has been then proof of actually people seeing it. So we know that depending on the store, you're at off of receipt transactions, you're getting between 30 and 60,000 unique transactions per month. Just depends on the store between 30 and 60 busy stores are getting 60.

And we know because they are stories, share the data with us here is how many transactions, right? So that's one way, I think there was a couple of tools you shared with me that maybe you could share them if you want to. But I thought some of the, uh, the mobile location data depends who you're using for that is amazing.

If you can afford to get that data and. Yeah. I'd like to hear that things you have to say before I spill the beans on. Now, the tools you showed me it's, you know, so I'm the converted digital marketer, right? I was in the world of, out of home. I was the online marketing guy in the rest of the world. We call that digital marketing.

Um, and as soon as I saw Geopack. I thought, wait a second. I can plan a billboard campaign the same way that I can play off Facebook campaign. That's that's ridiculous. And, and once I started to go into people's Google analytics to see the power of out-of-home right, we've got all these great Nielsen studies, it drives more search than TV, print, radio combined, you know, sales per dollar spent, or the highest against all the traditional means.

We know all these things to be true, but how, how can I prove that to somebody that's spending money, Tim? That's great. That's a great flyer you got from your own governing body. Exactly. It's like the dairy industry doing a paper on why to drink milk it's, you know, it's you and I to talk about, but how do you articulate that story to someone?

So I started looking inside a Google analytics. Uh, no shit like this is, this is the real deal. Holy field. This person changed nothing else about their campaign and they're getting 40 to 50% more organic and direct traffic to their website. So, okay. If we know that people do a website can be valuable and I can look at what's, what's that traffic doing once it's on the website, is it spending a lot of time?

Is it visiting multiple pages that all tells a story? But what if I set up conversion goals in Google analytics? And I can say, Hey for everybody, every time that someone clicks on this button, which fills out this form for every time someone clicks on this button, I know that one out of every two people is going to buy something and that the average purchase is $20.

So that means for every click it's worth $10. So now I can actually assign a value. I can say from start to finish, my out-of-home campaign drove this many additional visitors, this many additional visits. This many, took an action and have the number that took action. I know that the value to that is this is that value above and beyond the out of home spend.

If it is great, there's not too much more to the conversation. If it's not now, let's talk about how out of home actually influences the rest of your media mix and impacts results across the chain. Right? So that was my aha moment. When I realized I could build campaigns like Facebook ads and it in Google analytics.

So that's awesome. Cool. But as these tools are developing and we're talking about foot traffic, right? Everybody wants to know, Hey, someone saw my ad, did they show up or not? We want that tangibility to return. So there's some great tools available. Um, one in particular is reveal mobile and they, I think we're working with a lot of different spaces, but started to see how their, their information can be valuable for out of home campaigns.

They can measure a percentage of the people that see your ads. About 15%. They can measure those device IDs and say, Hey, this particular client, this restaurant in town, they did 10 posters. The people that were exposed to those posters. Last month, only 2% of those people showed up this month. That last month, when there was no campaign, 2% showed up.

This was when there was a campaign up 5% showed up. So now we're talking about what's that quantifiable lift. I was able to improve the number of people that show up to your restaurant, right? For every hundred, you went from two people showing up to five, how powerful is that conversation? But then we get too excited.

We get too excited about the foot traffic thing that we lose sight of maybe some how someone's business works. And at the end of the day out of home fits into a lot of different places within the funnel. But. For us as a billboard company, most often it's going to be top of the funnel unless you're a QSR.

So I said, that's a bit of a predicament, right? We can't go into a car dealership talking about foot traffic because a lot needs to happen. You need to see the billboard. You need to go to their website. The website needs to not suck. Then they need to have the car in stock that you're interested in. It needs to be at a competitive price.

You may call or submit a web form and say that you're interested in more information. Then someone on their end needs to not fuck it up. And then you need to be so compelled to show up, why am I going to handcuff myself to foot traffic for a car dealership that doesn't make a lick of sense because so many things need to go right before that person actually shows up and does business.

And I'm already to only tracking 15% because I want the highest quality of data. So that doesn't make sense. Well now, are we back at ground zero? What do we do? So sort of came to me as an epiphany. So this is a scale. So I call it the commitment scale and low commitment, medium commitment, high commitment for a low commitment transaction, like going to get a burger on a Tuesday afternoon on the way home for your work.

There's not a lot to it, right. Don't need to think about it too hard. Am I hungry? Yes or no? Yes I am. Is it convenient? Is it affordable? If it is. I can track foot traffic, right? That there's no commitment to that. I'm just stopping to get a burger. Medium commitment could be maybe like a retail location, a, um, uh, a makeup store, maybe going to the movies where people are still going to go out.

They need to see touch, feel the product, but there's some more consideration to it, right? Is the movie playing at a time that I can get the family together? Do I have the extra income to go drop 150 bucks at the movie theater this week for my family at six? You know, so these things require a little bit more commitment, but it's not the same as buying a house or a car, which is the high commitment end of the scale, the high commitment.

There's all those things need to take place. So for low commitment businesses, we're going to track foot traffic for high traffic businesses. We're not going to attract foot traffic. We're going to tell a story in Google analytics and for people in the middle, we're going to sort of maybe do a hybrid of both.

That's the commitment scale. That's how I'm approaching attribution. I don't know. Uh, why did you make a deck about that yet? Did you make a deck with like multiple slides and share that on LinkedIn? No, I haven't, man. That was going to be my go-to 2020 talk. Oh,

well, you're going to have a talking to you'd have slides. Yeah. So on the egg jump on Fiverr th yeah. Yeah. Well, that's, that's why I got to do virtual. It's going to be a virtual lunch and learn. Um, I'm thinking about doing grub hub gift cards or door dash gift cards and do sessions with agencies to walk through that.

Oh really? Yeah. Yeah. I figured I I'd hate for it to go to waste. I think virtually. Yeah. Why not? Right. I've been doing zoom meetings for a long time, so it's great opportunity for agencies, planners, outdoor companies, whoever, whoever could benefit from that information. But, uh, yeah, I don't know. I'm thinking about just.

Thanks, man. That was excellent. Yeah. This is very a fair place to start from for the measurement conversation. Yeah. You know, I got ask what everyone's, what is their KPIs, right? How are they going to measure success? How are they going to measure? Like you said, foot traffic may not be for everyone real estate agents.

If they're advertising or like real estate firm, who's coming swooping up like a Keller Williams or Coldwell banker or Redfin, Redfin. Are they getting like foot traffic? I don't know about that, but it would be leads, leads that they share down to their whole downline. So I like to say I don't home is a driver.

It's a gateway drug. Some can be standalone, like directional way-finding signage in a mall. Like we sell a lot of that. It's over here. If you want to get that ice cream, you know, over here, if you want to get that. Super easy. It's great. But when you're, you know, that's it, but some of them was a driver to online.

And like you said, your website can't suck because you could be sending all this traffic to the website, but if it doesn't show up good on mobile and you got to zoom in and you got to pinch my fingers fat. So I hit the wrong button. I had a bad experience. The links are broken, someone's using flash flash.

It doesn't show up.

It's only part of the, it's only part of the conversation. It takes a holistic approach. I was just today. I was thinking to myself, I'm like, all right, who can I prospect right now that it wouldn't be too salesy? Right. Wouldn't be a pushy thing. It would make sense for their business. And you know, it was potentially someone that I could help that.

Wait a second golf courses are the best way to socially distanced yourself and get the hell out of the house. I can't think of anything more socially distant, the 370 yard dog leg left, like it's me and one other person. And we're in the middle of nowhere. Golf course make sense. Right. So I was like, okay, let me look at golf courses within my footprint here in Easton, Pennsylvania, about 30 of them, John Paul, I had to drop off five or six of them as prospects because they either didn't have websites, didn't have websites.

They were using like their Facebook page or like a page on a resorts website. That was just like one page like, Hey, we have golf available. It was just, it was crazy. It was just crazy. 2020 people just not having websites, but there's advertisers out there willing to take their money and not look at things like that.

How do you, how do you approach things like that? Do you. Did you offer that type of feedback to your clients and like a consultative way? You're you're an entrepreneur. You get how these things work. What, what's your take? If I'm going to sell something that is not going to bring someone valued, I'm not

fucking, you hear me? It got a little soft on headphones. Yeah, it was. And then my wife called a messenger bumped. My head, the audio is good on the headphones. Hello? Can you hear me now? Yeah. Yeah. That's great. All right, I'm coming back. I'm back. He's back. Okay. So we're going to edit that part out or we're going to keep it, so yeah, if someone's going to want to advertise and we do this in design too, cause we have a whole design components are.

Let's just say you're making a business card. Okay. This is a business card could translate to a billboard. Sure. If you're having a business card and you saw a Nike logo, like I just want to put my logo on their car and people are going to know what it is say. Well, Kate, your card is a leaf and you know, you're a real estate company.

I don't think you're going to get what your leaf is because you didn't spend hundreds of millions of dollars. Let me know that leaf means you. I need you to have three things you need to have who you are, what you do and how to get ahold of you. Those are the basic fundamentals of a conversation of a reputation of a calling card.

Get to know you. Now, once they have that, if they say, Hey, I want to go ahead and promote. I had someone to do this. And I said, I didn't want to do it. And it didn't. It was a flooring company and they wanted to promote, it was one of those flooring franchise companies will come to your house with a van and it's like a virtual showroom.

They said, Hey, we want to put it up here. I'm going to try it for three months. I looked at their design. They wanted, it was just way too much going on. A lot of words, a lot of different flooring samples. There was a van that was the guy standing by his van. I'm like, I tell you, this is not going to work.

He said, oh, but don't worry. You know, my friend, my friend shies zaur they designed it for me and I want to use it. It looks good. People recognize me. He said, okay, you're going to be in front of Starbucks. We're going to be in a good one in front of Starbucks, big spot. And they're going to put you in net a spot in front of a hardware store where people are potentially renovating their house.

What's your ad says nothing about what you actually do. It's just showing samples and options. And for everything that they know, it could be an ad for byte.

Maybe three months, it didn't work. They didn't, they didn't resign. I wanted to say, I told you so, but I'm not that kind of guy that like, or salt on the wound, but w someone comes to, sometimes they listen, sometimes they listen and I say to a plumber who came, said, you know what? I have a picture of your team.

Cause you guys are family run companies, 15 people have your van have your team, but most importantly, have a list of your services. You know, clogged, drains what I said, what is your highest ticket item? And what do people buy bathroom renovations? They're not just cleaning toilets. They didn't bathroom innovations by 30 grand.

I was like, that's much better than a 40 or $50 club. So we got to do that. The first thing their ad actually said, they ran one ad with us and it was the more of a branding. It didn't really let even me know what they did. It said I'm going above the call or going beyond the call. And then their logo said the plumbing and the plumbing word is real small.

I say, all it looks like it says, go and beyond the call. And you have like a newspaper voted best of 2019. I said, this looks like a newspaper billboard voting, you know, this company anyway, they ended up changing it and they like it much better. It's clear and concise plumbing company who we are, what we do, here's our list, how to get ahold of us.

And then it has the team there because the family run company real clean is working there on social media. And it translates because that billboard or sign looks good to be on the wall, on a screen, on your phone and in your head. And then I write, and now we can predictably, right? When you said the Nike logo.

I'm curious what everyone else thought. So if, if, if you thought something, when John Paul said the Nike logo on a card, I thought of white swoosh orange background. I thought of the box dude at it. And that's what I thought of. But to your point, that's millions of dollars being spent. So for local advertiser being consistent, being consistent format in message in font, in colors, those things, are you going to be Nike?

No, probably not. But if you've got four or five truck service trucks running around, you got some great outdoor up and in high volume locations with a high residency exposure. If you're, if you're doing it right, it's gonna, you're going to be the Nike of plumbing. People are going to see your trucks.

They're going to see your log and be like, man, I see them everywhere. They are everywhere. It's not that true. You don't have the mind to be everywhere. You just consistent, everything talks to each other. It does, you know, sometimes these might be the first introduction to your company for the public to actually see, they may not know you at all.

This would be the first introduction. And like you said, with the branding, and they're going to start seeing you everywhere because you know, you're thinking about a blue Tesla, because I want to buy it everywhere. It'll stick in your mind. It's going to become familiar. Now they look at a subject they're like a subject matter expert.

I'm going to think of them, but I need to renovate my bathroom. I'm going to give them a call and price it. So this is where I start to nerd out a little bit because the brain is so interesting to me. So what you just said about the blue Tesla, right? Why, why do we, why do we see it? Why, why do you see it everywhere?

So there's a piece of our brain called the reticular activating system. It was, it was designed, you know, as a primal function for. Identifying who's a threat and who isn't right. If I'm just traveling through the wilderness and I see somebody, is that person going to be a friend and help me to survive and thrive, or are they potentially trying to kill me and raid my village?

I need to be able to determine that very quickly. So that system over generations has adapted to in the real world where we have an affinity for something, or we're in the market for a particular car, all of a sudden we see it everywhere. And everybody's got that blue Tesla it's same thing that was keeping us alive a few thousand years ago from warring tribes that now has advertisers.

We can take advantage of now being on target, right, targeting so important. And we've never had access, you know, with these things, device ID data, I can not only tell who you are to a degree. I ended up personally identifying information unless you're Google, just give her stuff. Um, too soon. So, right. So, but I, I know a lot about you, so I can say, Hey, 80% of people that pass this particular billboard fit this profile.

Now, when I put relevant content up there, 80% of the people driving past it, the reticular activating system is saying, Hey, that feels familiar. That that's something that I could potentially benefit from now. I'm going to choose that company because why that cluttered creative wasn't effective. Because if, if it's on target, if it's a message that's relevant and if it's easily digestible, I don't need to expend physical calories.

Right? The brain is the biggest muscle in our body when advertising is confusing or cluttered. And I don't know where to look or what. It's going to consume too many calories for me. So what's the brain do tune it out. I'm on to something else. I stopped paying attention because I need to preserve those calories because my brain needs to work when I get to work.

Cause I know my boss is expecting this from me and I've got three client calls. I can't worry about your ad dude, because it's too damn confusing. So there's some, some brain stuff or,

well, you lost me there. All right. So there's some brain stuff. Oh man. I was like, Tim, it was too many calories, man. Loading it all on. I feel like I need a couch after that. Like, yes. Tell me about here. This has happened in my childhood

that. Well, yeah, so yeah. Started to go down the rabbit hole and the blue test, but it's, it's neat. Uh, that's how some of that stuff works. And, uh, it's something that take advantage of as advertisers. You said something interesting. I want to tie it in. You said something about being relevant. It's something relevant that they can resonate with.

Sure. It's going to lead us right back to our conversation to opportunity. No, those people who are emailing me about getting, you know, hospitality list or trying to sell stuff right now and not being empathetic to the situation. Sure. We're going to remember those people. And if that wasn't something that we feel we want it's out the door, we're going to, we're not going to, you know, pay it no mind in the future, but being in a relevant conversation, these platforms of Facebook, Instagram, the LinkedIn.

These are all think of them as venues, think of LinkedIn as a professional business setting, possibly a seminar that has different breakout sessions. It has a trade show component to it. It has educational sessions to it. It also has the water cooler and a bar, and that's all going on that LinkedIn ecosystem, as you've seen, that's kind of how we met.

We met, we met at one of the breakout sessions at the bar pretty much. So if we can be relevant within this time and opportunity, people are going to want to listen to something that takes their mind off everything that's going on, because these are where we're going to go. We're not going to that trade show.

We're not going to that bar, but we can go online and we can go to that section of LinkedIn or Instagram, or be with the family on Facebook. So relevance and what resonates. You brought it right down this touch on that, man. I think that that's killer. And that's, you know, when I started doing this a couple months ago, it was really just to help me learn out of home at an accelerated rate.

It's been fun because it's turned into a platform to give people a voice and to have great conversations like this and give access to everyone at scale, you know, perspective, right. Perspective from different people, different angles. So while that's been, you know, just a lot of fun, it also sort of selfishly, and I don't know what it ultimately translates to way ahead of the curve.

Right? So creating all that stuff to a point now where it's not seeming like a pivot, I'm grateful that I started, you know, so soon doing that. And you've got, you've got a great show too, where you talking to entrepreneurial. Talk to me a little bit about that. Is that part of JPG, is it part of the brand overall?

Like you're doing some pretty cool stuff, man. You got, you got great guests on having awesome conversations. What's what's the Shogun. All right guys. Here's the real deal. So name of our company is JPEG.

You're JPG. It's JPEG. I'm just going to call on all JPG. Oh, it's all good. That's my initial too. By the way, Paul Gideon. Yeah, that's fine. They call it JPG. Cause like, if we were hanging out, I would just call you JPG. Cause I think of like GSP, right? MMA. I just want to call you. I get it. I get it. So yeah. So to bring it back, why do we have to show, why am I doing that?

And who are these guests? Like how, how am I getting all these people online and different entrepreneurs to come on this.

Entrepreneurs' organization global organization, there's over 40,000 members. Wow. There's different goals you need to be in, you know, um, locally in our Hawaii chapter, it's needed to do a million in revenue annually, and you have to have the controlling interest of the company or you're the founder. So I looked at it, we have a club of 64 people and I'm the communications chair.

Well, as I came in three years ago, I said, you know, a lot of these people don't know each other. There's some people who've been in the club 25 years. So it was first to just start off as connecting people in the club. I just want to make videos for the club members themselves to kind of share, you know, a part of the entrepreneurs organization is a lot of experience share.

It's a zero solicitation policy I can sell to you, but I, if you ask me like a vampire, right, you got to invite me. But I'm not going to be pitching you. And it's a way that we can share experiences and get a little deeper, real quick, dude. That was such a quick vampire reference. I just gotta give you credit in case no one appreciated how good that is.

Like you have to invite the vampire into your house or else he can't enter. So if a vampire is out, there's, there's a takeaway for you. Sorry.

I started this star of the show. I brought in a couple. Um, first I had our first show. One of my friends, Juno Chung Cola pancake house has got a pancake venues, got like eight locations. I think. So he rolled up and as when that camera flicked on, I was like, oh, I remember we used to make videos in high school.

Oh, this is going to live forever. This is an opportunity. I've got this. Of 65, 64 entrepreneurs in my relevant, fully market leaders, my company, and I get to sit with them and ask them anything. I want starting it up. So I hired a full-time content creator. Um, Alex Lang, he makes all of our videos or installs and graphics and films are our podcasts.

We call it a podcast to show video, you know, breaking into the audio and all that. I saw it as an opportunity, kind of how, like being an opportunity to be speaking on your show, it expands the platform. It also frames myself as a subject matter expert. So I could speak on things. You're guilty by association.

You're going to hang out with good people. You're going to be seen as a good person. You're hanging out with bad people. You seen as a bad person. I personally want to share the business. I'm super interested in business. Like I love it. Entrepreneurship, selling, marketing, advertising, everything that you like.

That's why we connect so well together for the show is really to expand the network and not to be selfish for me because that comes along with it. That's a by-product of the show. I'm going to get that. But featuring all these other entrepreneurs who I think are bad ass, but no one's really told their story.

I was like, dang, this is like a, this is an opportunity right here. I got a gold mine of information and real experience from people who have done and are doing it right. I just bring them on the show. I let them talk. I ask questions. I definitely don't frame it about me. It's all about them. Even in the title of the YouTube videos, I make it.

So they vacant share it. Now that lives on for them. This is something that lives on forever. And as a by-product I get a little bit of recognition too. That's why I started the show is a business development. But it started just as telling stories of my fellow club members. But now as the business development, I got some actual business from the show.

It's a beautiful thing. It's a Zig Ziglar thing, right? If, if you want to get everything that you want in life, just help enough people get what they want. It's that it's, I, you know, giving people a platform, giving them a voice that's paid. The biggest dividends is exactly that we'll, we'll do this and it will go to live on YouTube and Stitcher and Spotify and iTunes and people from all around the world are gonna gonna find it.

I was looking at my analytics, if you will. I was just sort of how it broke out. But 78% of the listenership on the podcast, variation, iTunes, Stitcher, Spotify, 78% domestic here in the United States, 22% abroad. It's been downloaded in 11 countries. It's cool to think about who's who's that person, you know, I looked at the Philippines.

I'm like, who is that person in the Philippines? That's listened to me. Talk about stuff that I love to talk about. That's so cool. That's so cool. It's 78% in the U S for the podcast version. You go to YouTube only 23%, 20 to 23% is coming from the United States. So initially I was like, just get, I'll just throw it all on YouTube.

It'll be fine. I'm so glad that I put out the podcast version as well. Cause it's both to reaching two completely different audiences, different parts of the world, different conversations, different feedback. Um, yeah man, it's, it's, it's been pretty cool to be able to create stuff from great conversations that, you know, the first time we talked, I wish that we had had the opportunity to just press record.

That's what a lot of this is. These are great conversations that. People want to be the fly on the wall. And let's just talk about stuff who would press the record button anal. We should do, um, on our next shows. And you can do this start with a one open. This is how we usually start our meetings. One word open.

How are you feeling? What's on your mind? Something to guide us in and then let's do a one word close. So as it's almost, um, you know, six minutes till three o'clock flight time, I got another call coming up with my list. You have any, um, thing you want to save? Or we do a one word. No, man. I'm just, I am, are you going to give the word?

Uh, we can both give one word poles. Oh, okay. Okay. So do I just say one word? And then you say a thought on that word or do you say well, how's it work? Oh, I'll just give my, my one word, like, I'll say one word. So mine right now would be family. That's kind of how I'm feeling right now. What am I feeling about?

Like how you feeling gratitude? I say family because my life locked in.

Yeah. You know, and, and not, not because it's a cop-out in fact, I'm just give you the reason why I'm also going to use family, because I have a little bit of a non-traditional maybe more so the modern family, um, I don't think she's listening to this, but a huge shout out to my son's wife. We got divorced about six years ago.

She lives like a mile from my house and it's awesome. And it's not the traditional type of family format, but we're making it work. Our son's thriving. It's a challenging time, but you know, kids need to see us unite despite the circumstance. So I'm taking family too, man. Yeah, that, so there we go, man. I like that.

We've got a family. Thank you. Thank you. Or I feel like you've inspired a lot of people. You definitely inspired me. So I love out of home. Can I get one of those hats, man? The hat I gotta get, I gotta get on here is like a sponsor, something tasty ad tasty ad is the home of the hat. Some people think I got it.

Custom made. Uh, I bought it tasty and you can pick you out up and uh, we'll definitely do this again. So on behalf of John Paul, but have the out-of-home insider show with everybody. If you know someone that this could be helpful, please share it. Jump, jump, word, people, find you so you can find us online. I, on my LinkedIn page, if you type in, in my experience with no E just the, so in my experience.com, it'll take you to our Instagram page.